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lonelyboy
12-22-2005, 01:15 AM
Well I decided to look for girls from States.
And what did I find ! A huge amount of very beautiful girls !
Look much better than any Russian girls !
I sent 3 letters. Got soon 1 answer from a white girl. The girl informed in her profile that she looks for a man 40 - 60 yrs. So my age. She is 28.
In the second letter she is in love with me !!!!
Even faster than any Russian girl before !
By the way I wonder very much why men from US are looking for Russian girls. There are so much good looking girls from your country !

ham
12-22-2005, 07:42 AM
what's she looking for...? A pimp? A sugar daddy? A sponsor...

quote:In the second letter she is in love with me !!!!


yes, right...and s/he ( you never know there too ) is expecting your baby because you plugged your d!ck into the USB or firewire port.


quote:Got soon 1 answer from a white girl.

if you're a non-white seeking white broads, beware.
This has nothing to do with Hitler or the KKK, but with the fact some people and agencies willingly play the "age" and "race" card.
The quickest way to subdue you.
I personally spotted at least two big agencies having on their front page their FSUWs love negroes & other races, which is false.
Agencies telling the lie women love biblical age gaps are way too many.
Unless you're Stephen King, Sting or else, it doesn't work that way.

My limited experience with dating shows the $-sugar daddy item is there...always...unless you're in a big metro area & meet casually for sleaze & one-night-stands (but most are mercenary there, too ).
I once had a painful experience with a real american girl...she said she had family problems & needed to pay $ back for whatever reason...she was madly in love with me & this & that.
Once i made clear i was nowhere near the "millionaire" she needed, she stopped contact under the pretense she was heart-broken due to some death in her family ( see how close we get to FSU scams? ).
Further investigations suggested she was sleeping with her boss, old enough to be her father.

Another american girl from a decent military family very likely expected me to "help" with her outstanding student & else debts. Once i ignored her "ways" repeatedly, well she realized we were not compatible after all. Further investigation suggested she had been sleeping with a number of parties seeking the big guy probably.



quote:There are so much good looking girls from your country !


beware fake pictures, gender bending etc are veeeery common.

lonelyboy
12-22-2005, 08:22 AM
Probably the problems with American girls can be the same as with the Russian girls. So far this is my first experience with them. But very few inform and write about the scams with them.
I am a white man from North Europe....
Anyway her letters are very much different compared to letters from Russian girls. But I am not going to fall in her so easily...
Time will show now what happens...
But Ham, you did not give any comments to my main question.
Why so many American men look for the Russian girls instead of girls from US ?
Ham, there are a lot of young women who like more older men and also many men who like older women. Love is seldom depending on the age gap, there are more important factors.

ham
12-22-2005, 10:48 AM
quote:there are a lot of young women who like more older men and also many men who like older women.

i don't believe this.
one in a million, perhaps.
I'm not talking about sponsorships of various shapes & forms.
As well, it all has to be put into perspective.
I'm 34 but i'd f@ck a woman in her 40's.
If i said i'd f@ck a woman in her 60's, that would be a lie.
Why would females be different?
Frankly, i can't see an "honest" motive behind a girl in her 20's seeking a man in his 50 or 60's.
Sure, besides mercenaries you get even a tiny % of mentally disturbed individuals ( the "father figure" syndrome ) who are many cards short of a full deck and are thus time bombs to deal with.
Sofar, evidence can't be gathered about say MOB marriages featuring much older men (EG 20+ age gap ), which lasted.
In real life is the same.
I read once about the editor of playboy who was "played" by a much younger model, who was having affairs on the side.


quote:Why so many American men look for the Russian girls instead of girls from US ?


i can only answer for myself.
I already quoted a few experiences of mine.
I can quote i "met" online countless liars & disturbed individuals.
By "disturbed" i don't mean say a KKK knight or a hippie pot smoking race mixer: i mean people with real, deep psychological issues worth of psychotheraphy.
I met people who claimed to be pop stars; i met middle aged divorced broads pretending to be cheerleading bachelorettes; i met men pretending to be women; one clown sent me nudies of some famous "nude beach" starlet from the 80's as his/hers/whatever!
Sofar the reasons why i stopped looking.

The reasons why recurring MOB fads are popular is because of the hype.
if you only make $800 a month you can have a FSU porn flick cutie because their salary is $40 a month: you'll look like a king to her

FSUWs don't mind huge age gaps. While western women are materialistic and praise only beauty, youth & soap-operas starlets, FSUWs value older men because they make better husbands. It is common to see a FSUW marrying a man 20, 30 years her senior.

Western women are career-oriented and neglect their families. They have this defiant "in your face" attitude about relationships and see the balance between sexes as a war they must fight everyday & win. On the other end, FSUWs are unspoilt, praise family values highly and are grateful to their men for being the master of the house. As a matter of fact, that's even more valuable to them as many russian men are jobless alcoholics into abusive behaviour.

FSUWs live mostly in old, soviet era buildings with no telephone, no TV and usually no tap water & electricity. The most modest western commodities such as a dishwasher are greatly appreciated by any FSUW.

do i need to go on?
That's why western men bought into the fad.
Even more so because i can say i love russian culture & am trying to learn russian and would like to relocate there, while most men are just after finer tail than they can get at home.
Agencies know this & purposefully target the most vulnerable audiences.

Sonar
12-22-2005, 01:29 PM
Forget American girls. It won't work for you.
If you are interested in an American woman, within 3-5 years of your age, then that's a different story.
If you think that Russian women are difficult, HaHa, just wait until you become involved with an American one.

A man's mind, streched by a new idea, will never re-gain it's original dimension.

Detective
12-22-2005, 03:10 PM
You can always try a canadian one too :-)
They're not that bad!

lonelyboy
12-22-2005, 03:14 PM
Probably I am not seriously interested in American women.
I just wanted to see what I can find there. But let's see...
You seem to have a very negative opinion about US women....

Ham,you are now talking about FSU women from very poor regions of Russia.
I know better St.Petersburg. I have never seen there an apartment without telephone, TV, electricity and water. Hot water can be sometimes a problem due to the low condition of water heating systems and piping.
Neither the real differencies in net money are so big compared to western. In Russia living costs are minimal compared to ours. Also Russian food, clothes, travelling, gasoline and taxes are much less. Many Russian girls travel a lot nowadays in foreign countries due to the opening of borders for free travelling. A girl who earns 100$ per month can do this once even twice a year.
Ham, we have a great age difference, different culture and experiences. So we see many matters in a different way too...
There is one matter in which I have a different opinion from you.
In Russia women are very strong and they take the leadership in a family. That might be one reason why men drink so much...Also if men don't give them presents and buy nice clothes often enough, women will refuse from sex... and this leads to the fact that men look for other women...
So in a matter of fact what is the reason and what is the consequence ?

elenag
12-22-2005, 04:24 PM
quote:Originally posted by ham
Frankly, i can't see an "honest" motive behind a girl in her 20's seeking a man in his 50 or 60's.
Sure, besides mercenaries you get even a tiny % of mentally disturbed individuals ( the "father figure" syndrome ) who are many cards short of a full deck and are thus time bombs to deal with.

Oh. [B)]
Ham, in your medical opinion, do I fall into the category of the merchenaries or the mentally disturbed?
My husband is 28 older. We have been maried 5.5 years... don't plan to divorce an time soon....
Doctor, please, tell me the truth!!! How much longer do I have?[}:)]

Detective
12-22-2005, 05:20 PM
Alright,
28 years elenag?? probably that's why you're here :D

Sonar
12-22-2005, 05:24 PM
quote:Originally posted by lonelyboy

Probably I am not seriously interested in American women.
I just wanted to see what I can find there. But let's see...
You seem to have a very negative opinion about US women....




Don't know who you are talking to since you didn't say. But if it's me then no I don't have a negative opinion about American women. I'm just saying that most likely a 25 year old American girl would not be your best choice. The reasons are too many to explain.

A man's mind, streched by a new idea, will never re-gain it's original dimension.

ham
12-22-2005, 05:38 PM
quote:Ham,you are now talking about FSU women from very poor regions of Russia.


i'm personally talking about nothing. The lines i quoted are typical agency propaganda, not my opinion.


quote:Ham, in your medical opinion, do I fall into the category of the merchenaries or the mentally disturbed?
My husband is 28 older. We have been maried 5.5 years... don't plan to divorce an time soon....


you're old news.
someone elsewhere claimed to be 30 & be madly in love with her husband in his 60's...although she would like to say take latino dancing sessions and get into active entertainment, while he's fine watching TV & taking a nap.
So when she'll be 40, he'll be 70.
Do yourself a favor and ask any couple therapist or psychologist.
I'm sure you are convinced you're the exception...i wish you well.
For now, there are news of more than few FSU-MOB couples with such age gaps where the woman had affairs, ending in divorce. Lately one was murdered by her then side lover.


quote: know better St.Petersburg. I have never seen there an apartment without telephone, TV, electricity and water. Hot water can be sometimes a problem due to the low condition of water heating systems and piping.


there probably is some misunderstanding.
agencies & conpeople love to portray FSU as a third world wasteland.
If that's so, then western men can "rescue" poor FSUWs...
i never thought Russia is Uganda & claimed the opposite many times.



quote:In Russia women are very strong and they take the leadership in a family. That might be one reason why men drink so much...Also if men don't give them presents and buy nice clothes often enough, women will refuse from sex... and this leads to the fact that men look for other women...


misunderstanding again.
Agencies & conpeople have vested interests in telling you otherwise.
I posted dozen times that:
Women from the FSU are from another country, not another planet.


quote:That might be one reason why men drink so much...

well, i saw russian census statistics...
the infamous sex gap, which agencies ascribe to poor health, drinking, unemployment etc among FSU men does starts to appear (although not so significant) but only for older age gaps, EG 40yo+.
If you look for FSUWs who have significantly less potential partners available, then look at the 40yo+.
Women 30yo & under have just plenty of alive & well male suitors at their disposal.
I understand why agencies & conpeople would want men to believe otherwise.
The vastest majority of men (=moolah!) rather seek women in their teen or 20's, not 40+.

elenag
12-22-2005, 06:13 PM
quote:Originally posted by ham
you're old news.
someone elsewhere claimed to be 30 & be madly in love with her husband in his 60's...although she would like to say take latino dancing sessions and get into active entertainment, while he's fine watching TV & taking a nap.
So when she'll be 40, he'll be 70.
Do yourself a favor and ask any couple therapist or psychologist.
I'm sure you are convinced you're the exception...i wish you well.
For now, there are news of more than few FSU-MOB couples with such age gaps where the woman had affairs, ending in divorce. Lately one was murdered by her then side lover.

wait, you avoided the question!
in your opinion, am I a merchenary or a mentaly disturbed individual?
i am dying to find out.

do I consider my marriage an exception? i don't know, most RWs I knoe here are married to guys 7-20 years older. and some have only 2-5 years difference. both groups do just fine as far as I can tell if their personalities do not clash and both sides have their values stright. every family is unique, i am sure my marriage is unique and an exception in some ways, but not because of the age difference.

RWs cheating on their husbands... i help to investigated them (RWs) when the time comes for the divorce so i usually get the full story with all the glory details... so I guess you could say that i have some degree of knowledge in this subject. i wouldn't say that rws cheat on their old spouses only. its a totally mixed bag. but i only see a small percentage of such marital problems (just the ones that come to me, or the ones I hear about on the boards), so i can't speak to anything else but my own impression.

every time I mention that my husband is older, people get agitated here (this particular board especially and even some posters on rwg). i usually get the whole "gold-digger / mentally defficient" package thrown in my face and then some. i am ok, i am used to it by now, but it kind of also insults alot of russian american couple that i know in here, and that bothers me actually

ham
12-22-2005, 07:27 PM
quote:wait, you avoided the question!
in your opinion, am I a merchenary or a mentaly disturbed individual?


only time can tell.
i have no idea who you are.
but since you precisely asked, then


quote:Detective Posted - Dec 22 2005 : 11:20:08
Alright,
28 years elenag?? probably that's why you're here


quote:i wouldn't say that rws cheat on their old spouses only.

now you're twisting the issue.
cheating can occur even to a 16yo couple of sweethearts.
Ground for cheating can be just anything, from boredom to sex drive to money to parenting to whatever.
However
20yo+ age gaps aren't the healthiest way and lots of divorces confirm it. It is self evident some who is 21 and someone who is 41,51,61; 18 and 38,48,58 have little (if anything)in common...i don't have to explain it.
It doesn't matter whether most older men on the internet portray themselves as fit as race horses, into break dancing, scuba diving and karate, looking 20 years younger...the older the man, the falser the claim.


quote:every time I mention that my husband is older,

again you're twisting the issue.
If you say you're 30 and your husband is older, most people will think he's 35,40, 45 years old, not 58.
If i say my girlfriend is younger, you can think she's 30, 25, 20...not 14yo.
It's not the same, although that is your sole business.

elenag
12-22-2005, 07:50 PM
quote:Originally posted by ham
now you're twisting the issue.
cheating can occur even to a 16yo couple of sweethearts.
Ground for cheating can be just anything, from boredom to sex drive to money to parenting to whatever.
20yo+ age gaps aren't the healthiest way and lots of divorces confirm it.
i do not know the divorce statistics, never had a chance to look at them. but how are those relationships unealthy?

elenag
12-22-2005, 07:56 PM
btw, can i take a look at those statistics? where would i find one?

ham
12-22-2005, 10:03 PM
i said it's your sole problem.
are you happy with a man 28 years your senior?
yes...? then fine.
Allow room for doubt and think 10, 15 or 20 years from now...if you'll still be married, then let's talk.
You read about divorces in the news...one was even playboy's editor.
I made examples already about why that wouldn't be the best option: stamina, lifestyle, life expectations, whatever...
But i'm sure you are the exception again, or think to be the one...good enough, for all i have to loose.
But to make it sound as generally doableit's nonsense.
I do [u]NOT</u>think the first coming man in his 50 or 60's can have an honest, successful, lasting, mutually rewarding relationship with a woman in her 20-30.
One in a million?

elenag
12-22-2005, 10:18 PM
i thnk it depends on a man.

elenag
12-22-2005, 10:26 PM
about divorces... please don't start with that! britney (spears) is divorcing her beloved husband. age has anything to do with their split? i do not think so. do they have the same lifestyle and abilites to partty all night etc? yes. did it help them? no. did it hurt (him partying while she was with the baby?) yes. what did affect their marriage is the lack of moral values. and a person with lack of moral values will be a bad marriage person for anyone at any age.

how much higher is the divorce rate among big age gap marriages compared to the same-age marriages? that what i was asking about.

the example of the playboy editor - please! anything else unusual abut his life except for this failed marriage? his young wife I am sure was a family orirnted Christian girl from a nice family. think about the kind of woman who would marry the playboy editer! it is a bad example, really, don't you think?

what else? life expectations? I hope my husband to live till 80 or 90, when I will be 40 or 50. after that I am ok. i may remarry or i may stay alone. most women outlive the men anyway so what's the huge issue?

ham
12-22-2005, 10:35 PM
don't get hot & bothered...
to me it doesn't hold water & borders nonsense...you may just have reinvented the wheel...


quote:his young wife I am sure was the family orirnted Christian girl from a nice family.

stereotype.
Do christian girls from good families prefer men 30 years older?
Good tagline for an agency.


quote:most women outlive the men anyway so what's the huge issue?

someone put something in your coffee...
yes, women outlive men here by 5-7 years or less; in some area little more or less...not 30 years...


quote:think about the kind of woman who would marry the playboy editer! it is a badexample, really, don't you think?


he was wealthy & famous but couldn't hold it together...guess how worse can (very likely) sail average joe bank clerk...

elenag
12-22-2005, 10:37 PM
he was wealthy and famous... yes, i am sure if he didn't make it, no one else will..

darn, it is pointless. why do i bother?

have a good evening, Mr. Ham/ was nice talking to you.

lonelyboy
12-23-2005, 04:03 AM
Ham,
I see that you have a problem about young women marrying older men.
Are you afraid of losing the competition ?

Getting back to the original story my "sweetheart" is travelling fast during our short friendship. Started from London, was some days ago in New York but now sent me a letter from Africa. I wonder when she will be here...

lonelyboy
12-23-2005, 04:18 AM
On many sites they do not accept Russian or West African girls so these scam by changing their origin

ham
12-23-2005, 07:12 AM
quote:Ham,
I see that you have a problem about young women marrying older men.
Are you afraid of losing the competition ?



i'm afraid of nothing.
those men should be afraid of a trip to the cleaners, as many before them.
But i'm sure they all look 20-30 years younger, fit as race horses, can breakdance all night etc and women are all christians with the best values...

[u]by the way</u>

There used to be an agency called IFAR.
behind it there was a MOB couple.
She labelled herself "christian journalist of higher morals" and promised men to find a 1950's styled woman for them; age gap? no problem, since she was married herself to a much older american man.
They were charging $35000 upwards; and that was the "matchmaking" part only!
However, class doesn't come cheap.
I remember them defending their business models on forums and pushing even this age gap thing.
A few years later IFAR disappeared.
The couple had split & now the "journalist with higher morals" emphasizes her "difficulties" and "differences" and blames her ex-husband.
But of course those 2 were two unfit idiots.
The man making it to the news because her FSU arm candy half his age got murdered by her lover is another unfit idiot.
A third man telling his odissey on another forum (now his fiancee is say under 15 years younger and they are getting married ) is an unfit idiot.
Another man nicknamed "Jawn" was featured by international media: an idiot, too.
I am an unfit idiot.
Others have reinvented the wheel...fine.


quote: he was wealthy and famous... yes, i am sure if he didn't make it, no one else will..

darn, it is pointless. why do i bother?

have a good evening, Mr. Ham/ was nice talking to you.

again: to me it doesn't hold water & borders nonsense. It looks like e-claims about all men making seven figures tax free etc: highly unlikely.
HOWEVER
feel free to prove me wrong...too bad many others before you couldn't and all were using the same arguments (unsurprisingly).

Sonar
12-23-2005, 09:21 AM
quote:Originally posted by elenag I hope my husband to live till 80 or 90, when I will be 40 or 50.
Wow, that's quite an age difference. Never heard of a 40 year age difference before. I give your husband a lot of credit.

A man's mind, streched by a new idea, will never re-gain it's original dimension.

Detective
12-23-2005, 02:30 PM
80-90 years !!!!!!!! Do u wanna change his diapers?

elenag
12-23-2005, 03:20 PM
quote:Originally posted by Sonar


quote:Originally posted by elenag I hope my husband to live till 80 or 90, when I will be 40 or 50.
Wow, that's quite an age difference. Never heard of a 40 year age difference before. I give your husband a lot of credit.

A man's mind, streched by a new idea, will never re-gain it's original dimension.

maybe I was wrong with my math above. he is 28 years older
subtract 80 minus 28, almost 50 right?

elenag
12-23-2005, 03:23 PM
quote:Originally posted by Detective

80-90 years !!!!!!!! Do u wanna change his diapers?

some day we all wil need diapers. btw, long time ago you were walking in diapers and someone had to change them. did you ever make fun of your parents for doing that? i hope not. btw, would you change their diapers if they needed it? it is a question to you.

to answer your question, i do not mind changing diapers if that is what's necessary. right now my husband is healthy as a horse (except for occasional back problems), so it's a long way away, but eventually this time will come for all of us. i wouldn't mind changing diapers for my grandma, or mother, or dad, or child, or husband, or brother, or just a nice person who needs help. i do not put myself above it.

i would do it for my husband and i hope he would do it for me if necessary (though i wouldn't blame him if he didn't. it is not a fun thing by any means, no question about it).

elenag
12-23-2005, 03:57 PM
btw, i do not understand this diaper problem. in Russia is it very rare for people under 90 or 100 to have it, unless they are too weak to get up. my grandma in UA is 84 or so, and she doesn't need them. she takes care of the whole household (she lives by herself), she is not weak and crippled at all. my grandma in RU is around 76 oe 78, and she doesn't need them. she has a very active social life and she used to teach people traditional Russian dances and songs. her memory sometimes goes out, but she doesn't need diapers so far. and the old lady that lives across the hall from my parents must be almost 95 -97 now, and she never had any diaper needs. here, in the USA, it seems that alot more people need diapers right after retirement... i wonder why it is so? maybe it is in the oversized drinks that are so popular here in the US? sometimes I look at a size of some of those coffee and coke cups, and i wonder how one bladder can even hold so much liquid. but i am not a doctor. i am just saying that it is my opinion that people in Russia start to need diapers only when they are too weak to get up from bed.

elenag
12-23-2005, 04:20 PM
quote:Originally posted by ham
There used to be an agency called IFAR.
behind it there was a MOB couple.
She labelled herself "christian journalist of higher morals" and promised men to find a 1950's styled woman for them; age gap? no problem, since she was married herself to a much older american man.
They were charging $35000 upwards; and that was the "matchmaking" part only!
A few years later IFAR disappeared.
The couple had split & now the "journalist with higher morals" emphasizes her "difficulties" and "differences" and blames her ex-husband.
But of course those 2 were two unfit idiots.
The man making it to the news because her FSU arm candy half his age got murdered by her lover is another unfit idiot.
A third man telling his odissey on another forum (now his fiancee is say under 15 years younger and they are getting married ) is an unfit idiot.
Another man nicknamed "Jawn" was featured by international media: an idiot, too.
So, that's your proof? Oh my God, i am even more amuzed now!
Hey, you want me to tell you twice as many stories of divorces, cheating, murders, splits, spousal abuse, hired murders, etc among the same age couples? I have alot of them. i watch CourtTV, and some stories featured on it are trully horrific. But you probably never heard of them. so I have a few very good stories about some of same age couples that were were VERY famous and VERY rich. or you could just flip through celebrety's scandals magazine... :D
i wonder what would my stories prove? that same age couples are unhealthy and just a MOB propaganda.[}:)] oh my God!!! the WHOLE MARRIAGE IDEA IS MOB PROPAGANDA!!!!!!!!!!!! I get it now [^]
ok, ok... i promised to say good buy, but you know, some topics are just too good to resist.;) so, i am sorry, i will try to keep quite now.

Detective
12-23-2005, 04:29 PM
I think that age difference is not a big problem if the couple are mature enough. It is definitely difficult but not uncommon. However, the reason why I don't even think of talking to a younger woman is that because usually they're immature. I am in my late twnties and I don't even think of talking seriously to a woman less than 25.... but this is my personal preferance only....
I agree with elenag about that but I think it is difficult for her even if she doesn't say it...

Detective
12-23-2005, 04:41 PM
elenag,
I really did not mean to focus on the diaper issue.... You have the right to do whatever you want... and I appreciate your willingness to do so if needed. All the best and have a merry christmas.

elenag
12-23-2005, 04:44 PM
thank you, the same to you.
i find it interesting that you didn't answer my question;)

Detective
12-23-2005, 05:18 PM
Well,
If you are talking to me I did not know what was your question? Is it why north americans wear diapers after they retire?? or is it how our bladder can handle all the juices we drink???
I will answer both of them and let me know if you need more info. I have no idea about the diapers and north americans since I came to canada in 2004... diapers usually are for incontinent elderly patient who have some problems with the pelvic floor muscles. females are more prone to this condition specially those who had vaginal delivery in the past (C-section is not a risk factor). Some urinary incontince is also related to estrogen (estrogen actually is very important preventive measure for urinary incontinence) and that's why this condition is not seen in younger females (except those who have some neurological issues like multiple sclerosis or cerebral palsy).
However, fecal incontinence is something different and again local factors versus neurological problems are the main reasons for that. Sometimes patients with rectal or perineal surgeries will end up being incontinent requiring a cecostomy tube or a colostomy for social control.
Briefly, incontinence is a disease of elderly mainly, doesn't have to be from certain ethnic background.... being an american is not a risk factor and being a russian is not a preventive measure.
Have a good day

ham
12-23-2005, 05:31 PM
your willingness to ignore the point is amazing and brings back the psychological issues i talked about earlier.
It is your sole business, however.
It's like claiming that being killed during a robbery, burglary, drive-by-shooting or else gang violence happens; and it has happened a number of times this year so and so.
THEREFORE
You relocate in a minority slum ridden by a motorbike gang whose members are just bailed out of jail, because hey...if that is meant to happen, it will happen without asking you first, right?
Or
That accounting frauds happen: they have this year so & so, so i have no problem with an accountant indicted twice for embezzelment...hey...if that is meant to happen, it will happen without asking you first, right?


you purposefully hide behind the "everyone can divorce" to justify biblical age gaps...well, it's not the same thing. Everybody can get a stroke, but if you're 100kg overweight, your artheries are clogged, suffer from high blood pressure and have a family history of stroke, [u]then</u>of course even some olympic gold medalist can get a stroke, but you're 100x more likely.

You're old news...i understand you are (now) convinced that you can beat all the odds & that you're the true exception...i think 95% of people think so, despite the 50%+ divorce rate, otherwise they wouldn't get married to start with.
I just say couple relationships are difficult; adding culture/language clash can just make them more difficult; huge age gaps can only make them worse.

Of course your case is your sole problem, but i don't see what you're pushing here...that everybody can have a blissful relationship with 30 years age gap? That most do? That you know you do? Or that "it all depends"...?

elenag
12-23-2005, 05:45 PM
detective, if you have medical background, i would love to ask you a few more questions.
i observed that the diaper problem (or whatever it is called properly) is considered ordinary here in the US, and I almost never heard of it while living in Russia (with several elder members of the family and very elderly neighbors). while living in Russia I only read about it in books. given that ethnical bkgrnd doesn't add or demenish chances, then what in your opinion could be the probable explanation?

my qestion to you (that you apparently didn't notice) was: would you change your parents diapers if there was such a need? i am just curious.

ham
12-23-2005, 05:57 PM
Men stand high risk of prostate discomfort.
from common infections spanned to/from the testicles to serious conditions like enlarged prostate etc.
Once prostate is tampered with successfully, incontinence is a must, not an option.
How many men do suffer from mild to severe prostate conditions?
I have no idea: many, however, judging from people i know.
I understand the "diapers" item is a polemic item.
A man who is 70 or 75 may very well hold his urine, but he'll very likely run into age related problems such as stamina, chronic pains, neurological problems etc.
While his 40yo wife probably wants to screw all night, he's barely able to perform now & then using viagra...forget dancing nights, exotic vacations etc.
My mother had many younger female acquaintances who were into chasing hunks, exotic vacations, aerobic classes, you know...
once hit menopause around their mid 50, most of them started experiencing mild to severe health problems, all gave up exotic vacations and a few were left by their "still performing" hunks...
In the evening now they watch movies, the hell wih aerobic classes.
Reverse question: what would a 25 yo guy do with such a 55yo woman?
hahaha!

elenag
12-23-2005, 05:58 PM
Ham,
with the divorce rate 50% (or at least you say so, i do not know the statistics), can you then say that marriage itself is worth persuing? according to your logic, if rich and famous failed it at so many times, what can we expect of the of ordinary Joe and Jane Smith, blue collar workers? i am asking you to defend your own argument which you used in some of the examples above.

elenag
12-23-2005, 06:01 PM
and i see you finally made up your mind: I am a psychologically disturbed (or half way there) rather han a merchionary.
ok, it is actually a nice change for the usual "gold-digger" i get...

elenag
12-23-2005, 06:04 PM
but if the wife is not into dancing (more like cooking and things like that), doesn't care about having sex whole night, and they have no money for exotic vacations anyways, then is there a possibility for such marriage to succeed? :D

elenag
12-23-2005, 06:18 PM
and i am still waiting for the statistic numbers that show that, all other factors being equal, the age gap marriages have lesser chances than an average same age marriage. and by how much, and for which countries.
because when you argue "statistically more likely", i expect you to have a statistic to be able to argue that.
for easier calculation, let's leave the marriages with the cultural and language difficulties aside.
or, if you wish, we can take only Russian-Italian marriages (since Italy is your country).

ham
12-23-2005, 06:32 PM
quote:Originally posted by elenag

Ham,
with the divorce rate 50% (or at least you say so, i do not know the statistics), can you then say that marriage itself is worth persuing? according to your logic, if rich and famous failed it at so many times, what can we expect of the of ordinary Joe and Jane Smith, blue collar workers? i am asking you to defend your own argument which you used in some of the examples above.


chances are very grim. How grim depends on the individuals, but long gone are they days of our ancestors when we heard of 40-50 years, lifetime marriages.
My mother's acquaintances are 4/5 divorced; the same among broad circles of relatives; things get worse with people 40 yo & under.
Marriages would last in the past because couples (especially women) were willing to take sh!t...in good & bad times...the "modern" idea of "no fault divorce", where one party can secede at will having with only ground their (momentary) insatisfaction, mostly for frivulous disputes, says all.
That has nothing to do with status or census...university professors and CEOs are at risk same as high-school dropouts working macjobs.
The only fairer chances might come when one is TRULY into traditional religions or values like say a mormon, a survivalist etc.



quote:and i see you finally made up your mind: I am a psychologically disturbed

instead of emotional catch phrases i rely on facts.
I'd rather choose a woman 30yo+ than some 16yo...while mileages vary, 16yo women are most likely immature, with high demands, overboard expectations etc, while (hopefully) older women have learnt a lesson or 2.


quote:but if the wife is not into dancing (more like cooking and things like that), doesn't care about having sex whole night,

you forgot knitting & reading the bible... at least agencies tell so...

elenag
12-23-2005, 06:35 PM
i see. so is that your opinion that no woman (in general or Russian in particular - please specify) before age 40+ can enjoy gardening, cooking or other such activities more than dancing?

forget the agencies. i never bothered to read what they write, and I am not planning to start now... just use your own experiences to state your opinion.

oh wait... you are from Italy. i have no idea how italian ladies behave, so maybe it is an unfair question that is bound to have a fault logic...

Detective
12-23-2005, 06:41 PM
Elenag,
I will be honest with you, as always. I will not change the diapers myself simply because I know my parents will not feel good about it. I actually think they will feel much better if I don't make them feel they're in need for me... there are always bunch of ways to help each other without really interfering into intimate issues. Christmas is on the way and jesus says if you want to help do not show up (kinda thing)...
That's my answer to you elenag... As for the diaper issues let me tell ya I haven't noticed this in canada. Things might be related to the kinda food the americans eat. For example, gastric cancer is more prevalent in japan and the reason is because japanese people eat lots of nitrosamines. Colorectal cancer is common (2nd most common cancer) in 1st world countries because of many issues (cancer is a multifactorial disease, requires multiple-hit theory) but increase in fat diet is shown to be a moderate risk factor for colorectal cancer. American diet is mainly constipating and this actually causes some functional problems that might end up with rectal prolapse and hence incontinence. Don't forget also that the incidence of Alzheimer's disease increases as we go older and this is also a cause. Other issues include the lifespan of a north american which is more than the russian.
Elenag, being incontinent is something difficult to treat... the frequency of the problem might also be underrecognised in some cultures specially the russian one (we all know how the russians are proud of themselves and they probably consider this a shame).
Hope this helps.

elenag
12-23-2005, 06:43 PM
thank you, detective.

elenag
12-23-2005, 07:10 PM
quote:Originally posted by ham
chances are very grim. How grim depends on the individuals, but long gone are they days of our ancestors when we heard of 40-50 years, lifetime marriages.That has nothing to do with status or census...university professors and CEOs are at risk same as high-school dropouts working macjobs.

Wait. But you said: "he was wealthy & famous but couldn't hold it together...guess how worse can (very likely) sail average joe bank clerk..." you used that argument to support your argument that age difference marriages will not last.
now it is "That has nothing to do with status or census...university professors and CEOs are at risk same as high-school dropouts working macjobs".

do you see a conflict in those two staements? or maybe (just maybe?) you were wrong when you made the first statement? please tell me.

you said that instead of emotional catches you rely on facts. what facts? that a playboy editor's marriage to a young model didn;t work out? or that the lover shoot someone's young wife?

and I have refuted those arguments. i mean i believe that happened, but i told you that many same age marriages ended the exact same way and you (i think) agreed.

now, with the chances of a marriage being grim, do you (you personally) plan to look for a spouse?

and you said you were scammed. can i ask you? how old are you were then, and how old was (supposetly) the lady who scammed you? i am curious... of course do not answer if you do not feel like it. i will respect your privacy.

ham
12-23-2005, 08:03 PM
this debate reminds me of the ones i had when i stated i disbelieve overboard claims made by many men about themselves over the internet.
The usual smart cookie would ask for notarized proofs of this & that & i was wrong & he truly was a six figures neurosurgeon & all that.
Once i brought US census into the picture, which disproved their claims, they still were right.


quote:Wait. But you said: "he was wealthy & famous but couldn't hold it together...guess how worse can (very likely) sail average joe bank clerk..." you used that argument to support your argument that age difference marriages will not last.
now it is "That has nothing to do with status or census...university professors and CEOs are at risk same as high-school dropouts working macjobs".

do you see a conflict in those two staements? or maybe (just maybe?) you were wrong when you made the first statement? please tell me.


I don't care whom you sleep with...i say: come after 15 or 20 years and let's talk.
Afraid you won't be there as many because of divorce?
Not my problem.
It's useless you yell yourself hoarse now...every freshly married idiot thinks he'll last a lifetime.
There is no conflict.
Wealthy people can have nannies, can take vacations, can enjoy every comfort...still stress & couple problems make those marriages end.
Guess how tougher it is for labour class Jane who must do her house chores, stretch a tiny budget through debts, mortgages etc, has two children to parent and a 10h-day job...no new car, no vacations...


quote:you said that instead of emotional catches you rely on facts. what facts? that a playboy editor's marriage to a young model didn;t work out? or that the lover shoot someone's young wife?


single facts make trends up...what an illogic statement...so if i say there is a violent crimes problem, hell, do i am talking about that one guy who got shot at the barber's shop and the other one lady who got stabbed three times during a burglary...?


quote:oh wait... you are from Italy. i have no idea how italian ladies behave, so maybe it is an unfair question that is bound to have a fault logic...

so, what?
I have lived abroad for years.
divorce odds in the west are pretty much the same.


quote:and you said you were scammed. can i ask you? how old are you were then, and how old was (supposetly) the lady who scammed you? i am curious...

http://www.antiscam.net/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=218

she was 5 years younger. I was about 28.


quote:and I have refuted those arguments

you refuted nothing.
you are merely stamping your feet and say you're the exception and behave like when one talks health with an heavy smoker or drinker...they come up with all sorts of excuses and reasons why smoking or drinking isn't much of anything and real health risks lie elsewhere...
i say: given many cases i witnessed or heard about, i don't believe it.
you go ahead & prove me wrong.

i rest my case on this.
Drink if you want, smoke at leisure and marry someone in his 80's...not my problem.

elenag
12-23-2005, 08:16 PM
oh shoot! you rest your case and i was just getting started... but as you wish.

Detective
12-23-2005, 08:43 PM
Guys, "elenag and ham"
I am not a judge and far from that but I think any person's opinion is based on 3 things:
1) His/Her cultural background
2) His/Her knowledge
3) Experience...
Briefly, It depends on where are you from and what kind of society and culture you are affected by and how much you put effort in trying to know what happened in the past and what's happening overseas + your own experience. Being a happy and russian lady and married to a successful american man, Elenag is more kinda optimistic in life and thinks that everything is possible and I kinda agree BUT ham's notes are real and statistically I think that ham's point of view is much closer to reality (unfortunately). Exceptions are exceptions even if they are wonderful.... like Elenag's story with her husband.
When a baby is born, he knows nothing about life. As life goes by he/she starts forming his personality by what his/her mind is capable of analysing + what is available to him/her. I do not really believe in (true vs false).. It all depends. What is obvious and true for an american might be weird for an argentinian. In anyways, I think we learn a lot from discussion.... so please carry on guys :D

elenag
12-23-2005, 08:49 PM
so, detective, i guess you at least can point me to those statistics that everyone seem to refer to. :D

elenag
12-23-2005, 09:01 PM
because otherwise PLEASE STOP SAYING "STATISTICALLY"! :D
no offense.

Detective
12-23-2005, 09:14 PM
Elenag,
Interpretation of three dimensional objects (basically everything you see) depends on the angle you look from. Same person, looking from different angles to the same object perceive it differently. Space geometry is a very sophisticated science and u can apply the rules to basic daily life issues.
I do not think I can give you exact numbers about divorce rate and stuff like that coz I don't think a randomized prospective double-blinded study has ever been done. If you want to study a parameter (for example: rate of infertility in patients undergoing rectal cancer excision) you have to have 2 groups: 1 control and 1 study group and you have to try to reduce all the bias ... it is very complicated. People in the study should not know about it. I do not think this can be done if you want to compare the outcome of couples with certain age difference. There are tons of interfering parameters that can screw up your study. For this reason, case report studies are sometimes usefull. I don't know how good you are in statistics and probabilities but case report studies are just descriptive and there usefulness is the bring up a hypothesis to be tested later on.
How can you test whether you are right or ham is??? Simply you cannot. I think that ham's opinion is based on some case reports and your opinion is based on what is around you, family, parents and friends. I do not think there is black or white in life.... there is always a gray zone..... there is an english proverb that I remember from before: no 2 watches run at the same time.

elenag
12-23-2005, 09:21 PM
it's a good proverb.:D

Detective
12-23-2005, 09:36 PM
You like it eh?
Seeya

ham
12-23-2005, 11:16 PM
http://www.divorceandkids.com/divorce_statistics.htm#National%20Divorce%20Statis tics

http://www.divorcemagazine.com/statistics/statsUS.shtml

http://www.divorcereform.org/rates.html


quote:3. PROJECTION/PREDICTION. This is the Census Bureau's often-cited "50%" rate, the proportion of marriages taking place right now that will eventually divorce, which has since been revised downward to roughly 43% by the National Center for Health Statistics but was moved back up to around 50% by the Census Bureau in 2002, with even more ifs ands and buts than usual. Most recently, according to the New York Times, it has been revised downward to just over 40%.



Etc etc.

Now i expect miss smart cookie to start bending over backward saying that is not true and that she knows a couple people who don't fit in...fair enough.
It is outright idiotic that society being what it is, she is out trying to dismiss the fact that many (most?) marriages end in divorce...

http://www.geocities.com/a280872/FSUWs-income-UA.html

shows the % divorces in Ukraine: 39% in 1990 to 47% in 2003 with a peek of 71% in 2000 ( economics playing their big role ).

Children born to unmarried mothers: 11% in UA in 1990 to 17% in 2003. % in the USA are rampant, with about 11% of white and 23% of african teen females ending up as single mothers (US census), with hispanics in between at about 15%.

Now % roughly compare.
It doesn't really matter arguing over 40%, rather than 50% or 50%+...it's pointless because the impact it's equally devastating.

So what is she trying to prove?
That divorces are fewer than quoted from source X?
Perhaps, who knows...i don't, neither does she, so why does she pretend to know?
That divorces are a negligible chance in real life & statistics are made up & most people live happily thereafter?
Look around...i see most people are divorced here anyways.

What i don't really get (and she'd dodging the question) is: what is she so desperately trying to prove?
That she's the exception...? That she's as good as she claims to be...(the diaper diatribe)?
I can claim on here i devote my life to little nigglets with scurvy & diarrhea to look awesome...
Easier said than done.
She reminds me of those that -against US census- wanted to reiterate their sixfigure income over the internet...
Yes, ok, there is 1% exceptions and you rank among them...fine.
You love to cook, knit, read the bible and stay home...fine...can you swear a majority of FSUWs fits into that parameter?
No way...it's your private case.
So, what are you trying to prove exactly?
That you're fed up with people telling you you're a visa raider or a mercenary...and that despite there are countless cases of visa raiders & mercenaries, you are a notable exception?
That many scammers purposefully target old men because they're a vulnerable audience, but you met true love & you're as honest as it gets?
That you won't back off & get tired when you're 40 & your man is 70? Even if he gets crippled, disabled, impotent or afflicted by other age-related ailments?
Who are you, miss Jeez-ette?
well...
all that is your sole problem.
i can only tell you of countless stories i read going the way i say.
I have no idea who you are and why you did what you did...i can say nobody has divorce in mind except conpeople, yet many marriages fail.

elenag
12-24-2005, 01:39 AM
ham,
save me a little time and quote the statistic for the marriages with age difference please.
thanks,
elenag

elenag
12-24-2005, 01:45 AM
because i do not really care about the marriage statistics in general. in MY experience (from what I have seen so far), not 40 but 70-80 precentage of marriages fail.

we were arguing about the chances of a age gap marriages vs. same age marriages. so, don't get too far away from that subject.

elenag
12-24-2005, 01:49 AM
and ham...
i don't swear. ;)

ham
12-24-2005, 09:00 AM
look...
you have your reasons to think the way you do...i don't care.
first you wanted statistics, and you were there dancing the rain dance because they wouldn't come...once they come, you want other statistics...if they came, you'd still want others...
all because you've a chipped shoulder and act like the drinker or smoker saying there's no increased risk whatsoever in that habit compared to other habits...they say OGM, air pollution & drunk drivers are way more dangerous, fine.
They are very witty and come up with all sorts of excuses.
Hell, if there are people into extreme piercing, bondage, cross-dressing or emasculation, you can be into men 30 years older...who cares...
You behave like the negro with the attitude of: you show me there are problems with the african community...as if it were not self evident.
Perhaps you can truly be 40 and "happily" married to a 70yo man.
I don't think so, but since you've been married for 5 or 6 years only, you have no idea, either.
Do you want to prove it is possible to enter into unusual relationships?
Yes, it is.
What i'm questioning is how long can they last.
Your need to desperately claim you can shows there are issues you should deal with: i simply say those relationships are at greater risk than usual ones, for which there is a 40-50% failure rate. The more adjustements a relationship needs, to accomodate say age, behaviour, habit, belief, religion, race etc related issues, the weaker the relationship becomes and it's self explanatory.
Say a countryside negro mormon female with heavy drinking habits marries some white inner city militant atheist into compulsive gambling...good chances, huh?
Now please let's end this here...come back in ten of fifteen years and you'll have more to show than this...i doubt you will, but you prove me wrong.

elenag
12-24-2005, 03:04 PM
ok, i agree. this conversation has been pointless for the last 2 pages.
but you have gave your opinion about me, several times in fact, so please allow to state my opinion about you.
I think that you are a snob, Mr. Ham.
Have a nice day.:D

ham
12-24-2005, 05:10 PM
quote:I think that you are a snob, Mr. Ham.


oh really?

Giles
12-24-2005, 05:49 PM
My 2 cents.
Join elitemate and see the messages you get from americans, I've had messages from girls ranging from 19 upwards. I'm 34 and want a girl around my age.
Just got one from a 23 year from wisconsin , I may answer her and the others but I think they are (Possible Scammers)

In the local bar I goto I was chatted up by a very nice girl I nearly went out with until I found out she was only 18.
Another time in the same bar I was with a friend, there was a 20 year girl who had been left by her friends she was VERY VERY DRUNK ie falling down drunk, a 50 year perv was trying to take her to his place, luckly we and a female friend took her home. She thanked us next time we saw her.


P.S. This post may seem vague but I have only skipped through some of the posts. I'm just trying to say I REALLY hate people taking advantage of genuine people like us and don't believe a younger women is after an older man. (but I could be wrong) who would have thought an actor would have become the president of USA. (No Offence)

Oh and join globaladies.com if you want a real laugh.


Now I'm not Buffy's Watcher I need a new Hobby.
Well I could get the Kawasaki ZX-9R out. Warp speed Mr Sulu.

Detective
12-24-2005, 05:51 PM
Ham and Elenag,
Rules for DISCUSSION:
1) Assume that everyone, like you, is seeking truth. Listen in a spirit of humility so you can learn from others, painful though that process may be. One technique to try is to honestly ask yourself "what if what I believe about this really is wrong, and his/her perspective really is right?" Keep this question in mind to help you non-defensively consider others' ideas.
2) Every person is treated with respect.
3) Read carefully what the other is saying ? if you are thinking about how you're going to respond, you are probably not reading.
4) Hope this helps!

elenag
12-24-2005, 06:46 PM
Giles, I am not sure I understood what you are saying. Can you refrase it?

And Detective, thanks i will keep that in mind! :) Given how politely your previous conversations with Nick went, and given some of your very nasty posts about your attiudes toward Russians, it is really funny to hear those words coming out of your mouth!;)

elenag
12-24-2005, 06:50 PM
but i agree with the rules! would be good if everyone (including Detective himself) would follow them at least most of the time.

Giles
12-24-2005, 07:11 PM
elenag,

What do you not understand ?

Do you think I should not try and date ?



Nick told me why he was banned from here

Now I'm not Buffy's Watcher I need a new Hobby.
Well I could get the Kawasaki ZX-9R out. Warp speed Mr Sulu.

elenag
12-24-2005, 07:31 PM
i didn't understand your post at all. something abouyt a drunk girl and a pervert... then something about someone trying to take advantage of nice people. then something about becoming a president... i was just not sure how to put it all together...

nick was banned???

elenag
12-24-2005, 07:34 PM
and i said that you maybe trying this international online dating stuff to early. i think you may not just be ready for it. yo are just too... volnurable in my opinion

ham
12-24-2005, 07:43 PM
quote:Originally posted by Detective

Ham and Elenag,
Rules for DISCUSSION:
1) Assume that everyone, like you, is seeking truth. Listen in a spirit of humility so you can learn from others, painful though that process may be. One technique to try is to honestly ask yourself "what if what I believe about this really is wrong, and his/her perspective really is right?" Keep this question in mind to help you non-defensively consider others' ideas.
2) Every person is treated with respect.
3) Read carefully what the other is saying ? if you are thinking about how you're going to respond, you are probably not reading.
4) Hope this helps!



i see things in a much simpler way, since we are not dealing with postmodern issues in clinical psychology.
I think that (like say a smoker or drinker would do ) Elenag defends her own choices and -of course- there are plenty of pro-tobacco & pro-alcohol pressure groups, which do so following her own method, that is questioning premises, common sense and asking no-win questions.
The matter is entirely subjective: you can drink, you can smoke & she can marry much older men.
However, it is nonsensical to discard as "opinion" the fact alcohol, smoking and huge age gaps present added difficulties in comparison with different situations: it is self-explanatory and the fact not all smokers or drinkers die or suffer from diseases related to their habit doesn't mean per se that smoking is an harmless habit as say playing checkers, chewing gum or else.
I am not defending a choice of mine; i am just in favor of common sense.
Do i think 30 years of age gap is same as 5 or 15 years? No way i do.
Nobody does but i understand those who do must defend their choices.

elenag
12-24-2005, 07:44 PM
i though we ended this discussion (as you suggested)?

ham
12-24-2005, 07:54 PM
in fact i'm not contributing anymore to it.
think whatever you want.
i wasn't responding to you...was i?

elenag
12-24-2005, 08:03 PM
ah... silly me...

Giles
12-24-2005, 08:36 PM
quote:Originally posted by elenag

and i said that you maybe trying this international online dating stuff to early. i think you may not just be ready for it. yo are just too... volnurable in my opinion


And just WHAT IS THAT surposed to mean !!!. Do you like slagging people off!!

So did Detective's post not mean anything to you, or are you a scammer like nike said. Don't pull this site down with comments like that. It's up to me isn't IT. I Can get hurt in this country too!!

I have now taken offense to your comments !!!. I'm here for advice not to be demeaned. Get me banned if you want BUT don't talk to people like that, and I am unhappy that i said you should have been a site admin here. with that attitude.

Now I'm not Buffy's Watcher I need a new Hobby.
Well I could get the Kawasaki ZX-9R out. Warp speed Mr Sulu.

Detective
12-24-2005, 08:42 PM
It's hopeless,
I think that it is a waste of time to try to convince anyone... Elenag, I was not rude at all when I was talking with nick2005... he thought I am a russian detective or whatever... and you know I am not...
I was talking very badly about the russians in general but now I think the russians are not bad...and thanks for reminding me coz I wanna apologize from you (being russian) and from all the russians in general.

Giles
12-24-2005, 08:45 PM
Detective, do you still speak to nick ?

Now I'm not Buffy's Watcher I need a new Hobby.
Well I could get the Kawasaki ZX-9R out. Warp speed Mr Sulu.

elenag
12-24-2005, 08:49 PM
Giles,
Ok. Then I apologize for saying that.
Three times I said that I suggested that not to offend you, but to warn you.
However, if you feel offended, I apologize and take my words back.

elenag
12-24-2005, 08:51 PM
quote:Originally posted by Detective
It's hopeless,
I think that it is a waste of time to try to convince anyone...
No, i hear what you say. And I agree.


quote:Originally posted by Detective
Elenag, I was not rude at all when I was talking with nick2005... he thought I am a russian detective or whatever... and you know I am not...
I was talking very badly about the russians in general but now I think the russians are not bad...and thanks for reminding me coz I wanna apologize from you (being russian) and from all the russians in general.

Well, thank you. :D Apology accepted.

Giles
12-24-2005, 08:52 PM
Ok, All is forgiven :-)

:) Friends again ?


Now I'm not Buffy's Watcher I need a new Hobby.
Well I could get the Kawasaki ZX-9R out. Warp speed Mr Sulu.

elenag
12-24-2005, 08:56 PM
quote:Originally posted by Giles

Ok, All is forgiven :-)

:) Friends again ?

ok.

lonelyboy
12-24-2005, 10:42 PM
Found some statistics from my country.
In a group of couples where both are under 25 yrs there are much more divorces nowadays compared to the group of couples where the woman is over 30 and the man is more than 20 yrs older. In this group the divorce is really seldom met. The marriage rate would be much bigger in the early stages of the marriages under 25 yrs, but the pressure of religion (parents, society, children) prevents it. When these couples get older and their children get adult and parents pass away they will divorce in the age of about 40-45 and look for a new marriage. Very often men find a younger woman and the wife stays with the children.
I wrote about the reasons already earlier.
With young people the reason to marry is usually sex, a sudden feeling of "love by first sight", unexpected pregnancy or fear to remain as old maid or bachelor.
Older people have life experience and knowledge and the marriage is based on that fact.
In Russia (FSU) there is a big divorce rate because they havn't the pressure of religion there.

elenag
12-24-2005, 11:24 PM
lonelyboy, what country are you from (I don't remember)?

ok everyone, I am glad we all found something to agree on, I am gone to taking care of my Xmas chores (cleaning, cooking). marry xmas to all if i do not speak to you until later

lonelyboy
12-24-2005, 11:34 PM
Well Elena, let me keep this a small secret...
But I can say that I am from North Europe, Lutherian area.