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Thread: psychobabbling

  1. #421
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    Hey guys! Prometheus, don't pack my bags yet. I don't leave until November 12th.
    quote:I consider PeopleS one of the most sane and rational persons, I've had to the pleasure to meet for some years, so I'm quite convinced he won't do anything stupid.
    "Stupid is as stupid does..." - Forrest Gump[)]
    quote:The FSU will for him/herself justify it and rationalize it, seldom being able to admit to 'doing anything wrong'. They really convince themselves about their innoncence, or can push 'guilt' aside very quick; leading to this selfdestructive denials of obvious facts.
    If you substitute my ex the D.L.H.J.W for FSU, you will get a better picture of where I am. Okay, mine wasn't an FSUW, but her self denial of reality fits with your descriptions of the bad FSUWs. Maybe my experience with her will help me to avoid falling into such a mistake with an FSUW? I certainly hope it will.

    Having given some passing thought to the question of where these FSU/MOB scammers all came from, I put forth this scenario...

    Once upon a time, there were no FSU/MOB scammers, only real women who dreamed of meeting a western man to marry. The reasons were several. With the fall of the Soviet Union, the FSUWs became exposed to western ideas and materialism, and desired them. It is true that women out number men, which can make it tough to find a mate, let alone a good one. Of course, a green card may have been motivation for some. But, I believe that financial and emotional stability was also a big factor in the face of economic instabilty in the new independent former Soviet states.

    Well, as the whole FSU/MOB process built up and became increasingly known to WMs, these men would send their ladies various gifts for birthdays, Christmas, etc. Some men may have offered financial help to their prospective wife and her family for legitimate reasons? Women talk! And there are always people looking to make a buck! I figure a conversation was overheard about a woman writing to her WM and how generous he was or that he sent her money to buy her visa and airfare to come to him. Next thing you know, a scammer is born! Write to WMs on the internet and ask them for money for visa and airfare, then just don't go. How will this foreign guy do anything about it? Besides, all WMs have lots of extra money! I'm just trying to make an "honest" living. I'm not hurting these guys.[V]

    Like anything else, the whole idea of FSU/MOB scamming evolved, and was perfected over time with many scenarios being invented in order to separate WMs from their cash. I need rent money, I was robbed, I need airfare, I need letter translation, I need money for internet, and of course, GRANNY NEEDS AN OPERATION!!!!!!!!![:0]

    And yes, I've read that many of these people DON'T see anything wrong with what they're doing. They're just trying to make an "honest" living!


    Train returns

  2. #422
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    quote:Originally posted by Amerikanski

    Having survived marriage to a FSU beauty, I'll give a couple of much generalized observations. I do believe that each relationship rises or falls on its own merits, but I wish someone had told me these things first.

    1. General pessimism. Western media and culture tend to be optimistic, a "glass half full" mentality. Viktor Chernomyrdin best summarized the FSU mentality with his oft quoted statement, "We hoped for the best, but things turned out as usual.? Someone who constantly complains, constantly criticizes, and generally expects the worst out of each new experience will wear you down with time.

    2. Mir mentality. The mir was the ancient Rus village that was the collective building block of civilization. If you are not a member of your FSU girl's mir, you will be viewed with suspicion. They trust the friends they had in childhood. Everyone else is expendable. "I may be married to you, but you are not my family" is how it was explained to me.

    3. Rampant materialism. When was the last time you got together with your friends to compare wrist watches & shoes? My FSU had a club just for such things. Chanel, Gucci, Prada, you name it. They are slaves to the labels and the more expensive the better. I thought a FSU girl would be less materialistic than a Westerner. Wrong. They are MUCH, MUCH, MORE.

    4. Really bad sex. I have to mention this only because at least a half dozen members of my FSU victims club have mentioned this. Many FSU women are gorgeous. I can't resist them, honestly. But it seems that all of my friends who went down this road describe a woman who was accommodating, but not particularly enthusiastic at the outset, followed by being completely unresponsive sexually once married. If you are into necrophilia, you are going to LOVE sex with your FSU bride. No touching, no kissing, stiff as a board, blank expression, and quiet as a mouse. You can ignore it for a while if you like, but one day it hits you, that rape would be infinitely more enjoyable. To her, it probably is rape already.

    So there you have it. I advise dating FSU beauties, sampling the goods, and leaving. Do not bring one home. You will not be able to house train your new pet, and it will bite you in the ass each chance she gets.
    I posted this more than a year ago using my nom de plume, "Amerikanski." LOL, every time I read it I am amazed by what a genius I have truly become. YOU WILL NOT BE ABLE TO HOUSE TRAIN YOUR NEW PET. Sorry PeopleS, but it is true.

  3. #423
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    Hahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Hey Prometheus! Have you read the on-going saga of "My Three Olgas"? It's starting to sound more and more like I'm writing from some experience I must have had in a previous life than the fantasy/fiction that I had intended it to be.

    Another installment is on the table and will be ready for public viewing soon.[8D]

    The fact that the FSUW that I am primarily going to spend time with happens to be named Olga is only a coincidence... or maybe it's a sub-concious mode of self-destruction on my part![:0][B)][8]

    Train returns

  4. #424
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    Sorry, my energy still comes and goes, so I'm an infrequent contributor at the present. I'm coming more and more to the conclusion, that my present state of exhaustion is a result of my now 3 year FSUW marriage.

    I have already commented on Prometheus' this same post placed at another thread, but as psychobabbling is my spritual home, I'll go more into detail here.

    Lately I have tried to formulate my thoughts about FSUW more precisely, without succeeding 100%, but Prometheus' bringing half filled or half empty glasses into it, hits the nail on the head. If there is a chance of being gloomy or querulous in any situation, an FSUW will very often take it, instead of being positive. It has always surprised me, that any help or support you give them has been met with sullenness or even suspicion. It's not that I'm a sextourist or expect people to grovel on the floor in front of me, crying: "O Massa, thank you, Massa". Even when you've given away $200-500, I wouldn't expect anything but a decent "thank you". But then I WOULD expect that (it's not that I own 50 oilwells). Apparently "thanks" is not part of the FSUW vocabulary.

    PeopleS, recently you wrote a post, where you theorized about the background for FSUW psychology. And ofcourse there's a lot to be said for someone wanting to getting a 'better' life. Many individuals from cultures with low living standards would strive for an existence in a high-income country, and even inside a given country, there is a steady stream of people moving from rural to urban areas for the same reason. But then, when such individuals have acchieved a higher income, you would expect some happiness, gratitude or good feelings in them.

    I've had some contact with WM marrying thai or chinese women, and these men give a complete different picture, than those having FSU contacts. The thai or chinese women seem to manifest some contentment about their bettered material situation, and their attitude to marriage (or equalent relationships) is much more stable and durable, than the FSUW. Besides they also are willing to accept 'humble' startingconditions in their new lives; it's not an immediate craving for status and luxury from the first day. So there are different ways of reacting to a 'better' life.

    As I live in an area with a high unemployment, I've often had to take 'beeb'jobs with low income and low status, simply to support myself (and anyone depending on me). But I've often heard FSUW expressing the opinion, that such is 'below' them. They want their cake AND eat it, preferably by getting a job as a moviestar, photomodel, university-lecturer or at least chief airplane hostess from the first day. Considering we both here in Sweden and probably also in US have people with f.ex. educations as medical doctors, working as cabdrivers because of bureaucratic idiocy, the FSUW's will for glamour is unrealistic and probably the reason for their ill adaption, once they do get to the west.

    I've not had Prometheus' bad experience with sexuality, at least quantitatively, but I must admit to a certain robot-like QUALITY. For me sex isn't just a physical activity, it's also romance, emotions, psychological intimacy etc, and that seems to be a problem. You don't get 'close', there's a 'sheepwalking' aspect even sexually. For me the result has not been so much frustration, but rather boredom.

    And as Prometheus wrote, the will for change is very small. They have 'rights' by just being women.

  5. #425
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    Hey swede! You, Prometheus and I all know that thank you is in the FSUW vocabulary. That comment was more for non-Ruskie speaking people than for you guys. Spasibo (thank you) and pazhalsta (please or you're welcome) were the first words I learned, and I basically survived socially because of those words.

    But, I understand what you mean. FSUWs don't bother to say thank you, except if she is a waitress and you give her an American size tip for bringing you a beer. I haven't had the same interactions with FSUWs that you guys have had... yet? But, I will be on guard for all of the behaviors that you guys have talked about these passed few weeks.

    Hopefully, I will retain my objectivity about my one Olga during our meeting and subsequent dates, and not be overwhelmed by her spectacular NERTS.[)]
    quote:PeopleS, recently you wrote a post, where you theorized about the background for FSUW psychology. And ofcourse there's a lot to be said for someone wanting to getting a 'better' life.
    I think that some of the stories regarding the abundance of women in the FSU as compared to the number of available men has as much to do with an FSUW looking west as a better life. I see the current FSUW who looks west for a mate as seeking several things, but the lack of Ivans, Sergeis and Borises must certainly figure into the equation.

    Lugansk is one of the "lower" per capita income regions of Ukraine, yet I don't think I would say we're talking US inner-city poverty by any means. These people work and work hard, but they are not impoverished. Many of the buildings may appear to be not so nice from the outside, but are often quite nice inside, especially the apartments and homes.

    I think that FSUWs, whether it's because of agency/website propaganda or because they live in a fantasy world, see WM incomes, compare them to FSU incomes, but don't bother to take notice of the western expense level. I'm not rich, but I obviously do okay since I can afford to take trips to FSU land twice in one year. I have very low personal overhead. Going by current per capita monthly incomes in Ukraine, I can say that if it was possible for me to save my entire gross income for just one year, I could probably live the next 10 years in relative comfort, if not complete decadence, in Lugansk.

    I'm sure, that FSUWs see these numbers, if not urged on by the agencies and websites, simply by not taking western expenses into account, and think the west is nirvanah.
    quote:I've often had to take 'beeb'jobs with low income and low status, simply to support myself (and anyone depending on me). But I've often heard FSUW expressing the opinion, that such is 'below' them.
    Well, you're describing my ex, the D.L.H.J.W. again! I made enough to support us and her kids, but it was a bit tough to get the extra stuff sometimes. I told her that if she got a part-time job that evn paid $100 or $200 per week, that's $400 to $800 per month! It's not a fortune, but what the heck, it would have been money. She preferred to sit home and complain about sh!t. Maybe she was an FSUW in a past life?[:0][xx(]
    quote:I've not had Prometheus' bad experience with sexuality, at least quantitatively, but I must admit to a certain robot-like QUALITY.
    I really don't have much to say about sex with FSUWs... YET!!!!![:I] But, in all the Russian porn I've downloaded, the girls seem very enthusiastic!!![:0][][)][8D] Sorry, I couldn't help myself but to write that!!![}]


    Train returns

  6. #426
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    As I've mentioned before, they man/woman relationship in the parts of FSU I've visited, looks a bit strange for western eyes. The men are EXPECTED to perform incredible feats of politeness towards women, feats which dwarfs even the rather ridiculous american habit of running around a car to open the door for a woman, who apparantly is intellectually or physically incapable of doing it herself.

    But while the FSUM perform this theather of handkissing, bowing, cigaretlightening and refraining from saying too many 'beebs' in his conversation, it doesn't mean that he will share householdwork with his wife (who usually has a fulltime job also) or give her a fair share of his income for familyupkeeping. His income is apparantly mainly used at the cornerbar.

    So a 'thank you' to a WM, who (hopefully) is more willing to split responsibilities with his woman in daily life, shouldn't be too much to expect. Being european and not a downtrodden wimp, I manifest enough selfrespect not to be considered with scorn by a FSUW, but still no 'thanks' forthcoming.

    PeopleS, you keep comparing your ex to average FSUW. I've had scandinavian alcoholic or drugusing girlfriends also, but that's not a straight comparison. While a normal WW probably would as interested in status and comsuming as a FSUW, she would be more likely to accept doing what it needs to acchieve it, instead of living in fantasies. Fantasies continuing after getting used to western culture in the case of FSUW.

    Can't say much about the sexual advertising from FSUW, almost never look at such because of the boredom implied, but considering the relevance of the promised romance, love, family-orientation and non-status compared to reality, I wouldn't take promises of good sex too seriously either.



  7. #427
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    Hey swede! Yup, I do compare my ex the D.L.H.J.W. to the description that you and Prometheus present of FSUW mentality. Depsite the fact that her mother's maiden name was Bjerke, and even forget the fact that she was, and to the best of my knowledge, still is a D.L.H.J.W, just about every thing you and Prometheus describe fits the little skank unconscionably perfectly.

    Okay, she was very animated when it came to sex, but her bad habits, "black cloud over her head" attitude, nothing is ever good enough (nothing I did was ever good enough), the world is out to get me, there's no way I'll work for a job that pays less than $2,000 USD per week, despite the fact that I didn't graduate high school, I deserve the world to be handed to me and I don't need to do anything to earn it, let me piss on your leg and tell you it's raining, and so much more that I need another beer just having thought about it!

    This b!tch would lie to my face and then try to make ME feel guilty about catching her in her lie! She accused ME of cheating on her, but as I learned, it was to reverse the subject and divert the issue away from the fact that she was the one spreading her legs in some other guys bed, or motel room!

    She lived (lives) in a total fantasy world of her own creation, full of melancholy, drama and self-deprication, while blaming everyone around her for the crap she caused to herself, her kids and those who were stupid enough to love her.

    And yes, I was the guy that would open doors for her, hold her seat at a restaurant when she sat, and all the other stupid ass-kissing crap that guys do. She may have said "thank you" but she didn't mean it.

    Train returns

  8. #428
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    Hi PeopleS,

    I can both sympathize and identify with you. You remember, I told you about my app. five year on-and-off relationship to the 20 year younger Playboy magazine-model bimbo (I mean, she really was the bunny of the month once). Ofcourse very attractive, as I gathered from your homesite photos, that your ex also was (is). And a drug-abuser as with your ex., only mine was an alcoholic. Deeply.

    That you lasted seven years in such a hell is impressive, and it's not surprising, that it has left a deep impact on you. I would have resorted to both green, red and yellow small pills in abundance after six months. But then maybe the famous patience of the native american (if that myth is correct) played in.

    Drug-abusers or not, I will agree with you, that some psychological female traits are international. Attractive women more commonly do things of a dubious character, simple because they can...can get away with it (I prefer this version), and the rest of the world, especially us dumb men, try to forgive them, because of our own hormonal needs and drives. Some of us never learn; some like me learn, when it's almost to late.

    Fundamentally a human life is like a car-battery (accumulator). It's needs a certain amount of charge to function, and as a battery gets older, its ability to be recharged diminishes. And special situations can make a battery 'old' faster. No acid on the cells; emptying it out repeatedly, if your car won't start; leaving it uncharged over a winter with frost etc.

    Such extreme situations corresponds to dysfunctions in a human. Especially when our emotions get involved in one way or another. It takes something out of you, which is difficult to put back in.

    But as you have said many times: "What doesn't kill us, makes us stronger", and I agree with you, until a certain point. Sooner or later a challenge too big for us, WILL kill us. Some challenges are necessary or unavoidable, some are just foolhardiness.

    Personally I would consider a relationship with a FSUW (or for that sake any 'stunner' in general) as the last. Unnecessary and too risky, unless I had triplechecked every single aspect first. This maybe sounds too cautious, unromantic or even calculating, but I know, that I haven't got, what it takes, to loose drastically in such a lottery one more time. For each meaningless drama, it takes me longer and longer to recharge and the final voltage-outcome drops slightly every time.

    As with the old maps saying: "Beware, here be dragons", it would be reasonable to exchange 'dragons' for 'beautiful (FSU) women'.

  9. #429
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    Hey swede! Your right that these bad relationships take their toll on a man's soul, and after a while, a man looks in the mirror and wonders to himself just how much of his soul is left.

    My biggest concern is simply the chance of missing out on something that might be really great because of the lack of emotion that I now have. I guess that is the biggest reason I am even entertaining the thought that my rather young Olga may be the girl for me after all. Despite this, I still remain very guarded concerning my approach to my FSU lovely and women in general.

    I also cling to a somewhat pessimistic view toward future relations. I have very low expectations for success along the lines of romantic entanglements with my 23 yo Olga, but have chosen to give it a shot anyway. Maybe this is a good attitude to have considering the overall success rate of FSUW/WM coupling appears pretty grim to say the least.

    Beneath my tough outer shell, is a stone wall, a moat filled with sea serpeants, an iron gate, another stone wall, a protective pack of wolves and an angry gnome with a pointy stick. Should some magical maiden get passed these barriers, she'll only find a locked box with what remains of the heart my ex, the D.L.H.J.W, chewed up and spit out so many times for so many years.

    Anything is possible... right?

    In some ways, it does make FSUW hunting easier for me. Not having the high hopes that most WMs have prevents me from feeling so down should things not go as I would like during my meeting with my Olga. As I say, I can easily go to Lugansk, not have a romantic liason at all, and still enjoy the vacation I'm taking.

    I will say that I'm not sure how much longer I will continue this search should this trip not prove to be fruitful in some way, but that will all depend on my mood after this trip is over. I'm really getting fed up with all the scammers, and I see no sign of them going away in any hurry. Still, I enjoy traveling, so I may simply continue to do this, but without the "looking for love" part buggering up the works.



    Train returns

  10. #430
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    You know, I like you, PeopleS.

    I put sensibility very high, and you show a lot of that.

    I hope everybody understands, that I as a person do not carry a grudge against FSUW or pretty women in general. And I completely agree with PeopleS, that it's impossible to generalise 100%. There's almost always a chance of the positive unexpected.

    It's our own EXPECTATIONS, which are the keypoint. OK, so PeopleS, Prometheus and I have had our wounds in the war of the sexes, and we even got some of them being decent guys, without much possibility of defending ourselves. I do not believe the idea, that we have the ultimate responsibility for everything happening to us. Try to tell that to someone from a koncentration-camp.

    But we do have the responsibility of choosing our future direction from the point where we are now, based on the wisdom or knowledge acquired from past experiences. We may even 'fail' again, until we learn.

    We may start with a battery almost completely discharged, a 'beeb' position, where our glasses look half empty.

    But the universe and existence in it is not static, for good or bad it's a dynamic process, and looked at it this way, the process is more important than the status quo. You can start from almost zero, but with directed intention you have a glass half filled (or more). In the end the process, our intentions, our direction are what defines us.

    Sorry, I got carried away with me own inspirational talk. This is partly because I recently have been through a rather tiresome period of recharging myself, so I allowed myself to indulge in a 'human interest' perspective. I'll soon be normal again. That is, normal for me.

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